posted May 01, 2002 04:53 PM                  

quote:

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Originally posted by shonda in ca:
I think I'm enjoying this thread as much as the show!

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I know what you mean! Also, I agree with all of the above said about the Brooks family! Aren't they nice? They are really good examples so far in their kindness, family relationships, and thoughtfulness.

The show reminds me of something my mother-in-law said once in jest. "Everyone seems strange except me and thee, and sometimes even thee is strange!" We got a good laugh out of it, but it is true that most people don't agree on everything all the time, and probably agree on very little most of the time. Why is that?

Lynn

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Daniel 13, Joseph 11, John 7, Michaela 3.

posted May 01, 2002 06:04 PM                  

Last night, Mrs. Glenn said that she believed (and I'm paraphrasing, here) that women who were in her "situation," back in the 1880's, would have left their spouse, stood up for themselves, etc. In fact, asside from the fact that these frontier families were usually in their first marriages,..not their second, most women of that era did NOT quarrel with their husbands in the manner she has, did NOT show them the utter disrespect she has shown to him, and certainly would NOT have called herself "Christian" and then behaved in a less than submissive manner. (Which, btw, means she ought to have "come alongside" her dh, not "ruled the roost." )

That being said, I'm not totally sure about whether or not we've seen all the facts about Mr. Glenn. The counselor in me wants to shake them both and say, "Put away your pride and work together!" Ya know?

I'm very disappointed in the Clune's. Just when I think they've stopped whining about their problems, and seem to be getting it together, he goes and builds a still! Good Grief! What is he teaching his kids, here??

I was disappointed to see the Clune family "step out" of the 1880's and start bartering with 21st century folks, however, Mrs. Clune made a good point about doing whatever you had to do to make it. I know the teens weren't concerned much about watching TV while they were "away," but they seem to be enjoying the involvement they're having in making the frontier life better for everyone in the family. Not as selfish, it seems.

I love the Brooks family! How awesome a catch is that Nathan?? I was in tears as Kristen opened that package. It was so special!

Well, I definitely want to see how things end for these families. Not sure about the kids joining me tonight, though. There were certainly some tense moments that I'd rather they miss. We'll see.

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Lisa Schafer ~ FIAR Conference 2002 and FIARside Chat Moderator
Wife to my wonderful Larry, and chatty Mom to Christopher-10, Megan-7 and Caleb-3 "Loving Learning, one book at a time!"

posted May 01, 2002 07:09 PM                  

Am I missing the big point to this?

posted May 02, 2002 12:16 AM                  

quote:

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Originally posted by Jen in CO:
Can I ask a question here?

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Of course, Jen...you're always welcome to ask a question here.

quote:

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I don't mean to be argumentative, but I don't see what the big deal is about building a still. Is it because he's making alcohol?

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My biggest problem about the still being made was the breaking of the law. This was suppose to be an authentic re-creation of settlers living in the 1880s. And, although the commentator mentioned that some folks did set these things up, it was still against the law! And, a man with children and a wife to care for, would most likely have thought long and hard before committing an offense that would have landed him in jail. Whether or not he and his wife believed that consuming alchohol was morally wrong or not, he just gave his children a "mandate" to break other laws. "Gee, Dad...you did it!"

quote:

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Unless I'm remembering incorrectly, they didn't give it to the kids.

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They certainly didn't show the children partaking in the liqour, however, the father did allow the children to help him make it, and bottle it, and probably sell it. So, I'm thinking to myself, "Now...when I was 15yo, and if I was given this type of access to "boot leg," what would I do??"

quote:

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Is it because he couldn't afford a "liquor license?" That seems like a minor technicality, not a blazing example of wrong living.

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I believe that the Clune family looked for opportunities to "cheat" during the experiment, and what did it get them? The experts said they're hard work was "misdirected" and "they'd not have made it through that first winter." They explained away every "cheating" decision they made.

And to me, they were a glaring example of what we try to do in society these days. We make good excuses for cheating on our taxes, not giving back change to the cashier who just mistakenly gave us too much money back, for not telling the counter clerk that she "under" charged us for those oranges.

Gordon Clune had an opportunity to show his children that there is more than hunger at stake...there's integrity. And, imho, he blew it.

Although I personally believe (as a Christian, and a recovering alchohol abuser) that Scripture does give us a strong directive to avoid alchohol consumption, I'm well aware that many people (whom I love dearly) don't believe that, and therefore, they'd not see anything wrong with the building of the still.

However, they'd not encourage their kids to break the law. But what if it had been him going ahead and hunting game? That was blatantly against the law, too. And yet, he'd have rather built the still than hunt.

I hope my reply doesn't come back to you any more argumentatively than your questions came to me! I love that we can discuss these things here, and know the person on the other end is still our friend.

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Lisa Schafer ~ FIAR Conference 2002 and FIARside Chat Moderator
Wife to my wonderful Larry, and chatty Mom to Christopher-10, Megan-7 and Caleb-3 "Loving Learning, one book at a time!"

posted May 02, 2002 07:18 AM                  

quote:

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My biggest problem about the still being made was the breaking of the law. This was suppose to be an authentic re-creation of settlers living in the 1880s. And, although the commentator mentioned that some folks did set these things up, it was still against the law!

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Was it? It wasn't until 1920 that Prohibition was in effect.

With scriptures, it is certainly clear about the sins of getting drunk on wine (Eph. 5:18), but it does not clearly mandate us against drinking any wine. Remember Jesus offered wine at the last supper as the "blood of His life."

Building a still, was at worst, a gray area. I personally would not want to be responsible to my fellow community members for making certain that the consumption of the wine did not lead to folly. It would crush me to see another (or my own) family fall apart due to consumption. Perhaps that is what the judges were also saying when they said the Clune family would not have made it through the winter. Valueable time was wasted on making wine rather than cutting more wood.

It was a fascinating show and great platform from which to discuss a number of issues that existed in our society 150 years ago and still today.

Heidi

posted May 02, 2002 08:13 AM                  

Hunting game would have actually been against the law.

Would it be better to break the law in one way (hunting) or bend it in another (producing liquor). Either way might make the difference between life or death. I think they blew their integrity in a much larger way by trading with the locals.

I'm not saying it was a really great thing to do, but I just didn't get why so many people were mentioning it as a example of bad living.

The Clune family did seem to be able to justify anything they felt like, to themselves at least, and I don't think they really kept within the spirit of the project. But I think the still itself was both permissible within the confines of the project and legally.

***Although I personally believe (as a Christian, and a recovering alchohol abuser) that Scripture does give us a strong directive to avoid alchohol consumption, I'm well aware that many people (whom I love dearly) don't believe that, and therefore, they'd not see anything wrong with the building of the still.*** Can you tell me where this is? I'm still pretty new at studying the Bible, and it's entirely possible that I just don't know what directive it is you're citing here. I had thought it only talked about drunkeness, and not just the consumption of alcohol.

No, I didn't feel your response was argumentative. Sometimes as a new Christian, I just need to ask these things because I really don't know so I appreciate that you took the time to answer.

posted May 02, 2002 08:29 AM                  

Holly

posted May 02, 2002 09:26 AM                  

The entire band of our founding fathers and settlers in this country who made us a free country defied a king and broke every law there was. It was the ones who obeyed the "laws" who were tarred and feathered, jailed, and banned to Canada in some cases. Do we honor or hate those people who defied the law? Did the original homeschoolers break laws?

I thought I heard Mr. Clune voice that he would like to teach his children responsibility in the area of alcohol?

Just my opinions. I have to say I liked them all, every last one, and I think they all learned from this.

Lynn

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Daniel 13, Joseph 11, John 7, Michaela 3.

posted May 02, 2002 07:47 PM                  

I was disappointed in the focus also. I hoped for more "life like it was" and not the soap opera antics. I got the distinct impression that the camera operators/producers actually facilitated this fueding "rumor this and rumor that" and "what do you think about so and so".

Thanks to your posts, I now have an idea about the rest of the show. I do not think I will be letting the little ones finish the series.

This was to be a learning program for us - it will be in more ways than one! Studying the characters will be more of the learning than "life like it was".

Blessings,
Dee

posted May 02, 2002 11:24 PM                  

quote:

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Originally posted by Lynn, NC:
I have to say I liked them all, every last one, and I think they all learned from this.

Lynn

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Good observation...they all learned something....which leads me to ask: What would you have learned in this situation? By "you" I am refering to all of us in general.

I must confess that given the hardships they faced, would I have coped in a manner that I would want on national television? Would my dh and I have snapped at each other in annoyance? Would I have let a swear word escape? Would I be a witness of my Christian faith to unbelievers watching the program? Would I have "the peace that passeth understanding" when my children were hungry?

I am sure I would have gone about a number of things in a different way....but I cringe to think about what may slip out for the world to see!

A few years ago I went through one of the most frightening and challenging times in my life. (looooong story). It was humbling to be made so aware of my weaknesses. I once heard the expression that you don't really find out where all the leaks in the roof are until the big storm comes. Of course, discovering my weaknesses has given me the opportunity to address them and grow. The same applies to the people in the show, and it may take several years for some of them to evidence true growth from their challlenging experiences.

This show has given me a lot to think about....

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Kathleen, wife to Jon, and Mom to Kristen (6), Rebecca (3), and Curtis (17m)
"...for the joy of The Lord is your strength." Nehemiah 8:10

posted May 03, 2002 01:02 AM                  

quote:

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Originally posted by Kathleen M:
I once heard the expression that you don't really find out where all the leaks in the roof are until the big storm comes.

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I really agree with this. I've been thinking about this lately, too. We have recently been challenged as well, although nothing life or death. It was a constant struggle to be a decent human and remember that Davin was just as stressed as I was. I had to work hard to try to keep my relationship with my husband and with God moving and growing. There were a few times I wasn't successful :o
I'm sure if I saw footage of some of those blowups I'd cringe now.